Request return of funds lost in bonding

Proposals
1

Proposal Submitted: Snapshot [INSERT HASH]

Purpose

*The purpose of this proposal is to… Kindly ask the DAO to return my fund lost in the bonding process

Details

Today i went to open up some bond positions, while I thoroughly read the documentation, I found it vague and ended up making a mistake and attempted to add to two of the bonds. My entire investment was lost, several thousand dollars, was donated to this Dao. While I understand it is my error, I am asking the DAO to please return my investment. This seems like a VERY harsh penalty.

I have been on Soulswap since its started, I have provided many thousands of dollars in liquidity to this platform. This is money that has helped Soulswap become what it is today. Until now this has been a great experience, and I have been an advocate for soulswap to many people both on my NFT platform as well in my FB crypto group 'Crypto Curious".

If the Dao would see to returning my lost funds, I would be willing to sacrifice 10% of the funds as a penalty, which seems fair. I also will agree to provide everything remaining back to the platform as liquidity and leave it for up to 6 months. I can do this as a new bond, or in the liquidity farms, whichever is preferred. This seems like a win win…

I want the DAO as a group to understand that I, like you all, worked very hard for this money, I have a family, and we are using this site simply because we want to get ahead and live a better life. This is a huge set back for us.

I ask the DAO to vote yes on returning these funds and I will agree to restake them as liquidity on soulswap.

going forward, in an effort to keep others from running into this same problem, I propose that the bond mechanism be better clarified, and some sort of time lock be placed on the bond itself. I know from everyones response to this that the general consensus is “its your fault, its thoroughly explained” . but the truth is this will continue happening until this issue is addressed. i know the friendly team at soulswap does NOT “want” people to lose their money, I believe in my heart that is not their intention. As such, there is nothing wrong with installing better safeguards to protect future investors to running into the same problem I did.

With respect, thank you.

//DJS


TOPIC VAR1 VAR2

Implementation

[Insert implementation details here]

Voting takes place here: Snapshot [INSERT HASH]

2 Likes
2

Were you able to create the proposal on https://enchant.SoulSwap.finance? Be sure to do so and include the link in your original post, so they know where they can vote on the proposal.

Also, please provide the transaction you made to mint SOUL, so we know how much is being requested along with other relevant details, thanks!

3

I understand and feel your pain and loss but I would vote No to this proposal. We have all some how lost funds in the world of defi and have all some how gained. Belief that defi will continue to grow is the reason we are still in it otherwise we’d have left.

Soulswap has been very innovative and it’s like a roller coaster (Exciting) with the direction they are taking. Sometimes they have released stuff and the community has jumped in without fully understanding it. That’s why personally I’ve waited and don’t get in till I fully understand.

The announcement for soul bonding came with serious warning to read and be careful with what you doing with bonding. This amounts to DYOR and take caution before transacting. Some choose to abstain from bonding until they understood it exactly and did not rush in even with the extra high attractive APY. Some because of the high APY rushed in without fully reading the documentation and how it really works. This in my opinion is where the greed comes in.

If this proposal where to pass, then I’d set a precedence for other people to receive refunds based on their mistakes. Mistakes steaming not from lack of knowledge but from greed.

It is best to exercise caution and double check everything your getting into. financial advice -don’t risk funds you can not afford to lose. Personally I’ve learned some very tough lessons so now whatever I risk and lose doesn’t stop me or hold me back.

In conclusion, I’m sure there have been instances where you have benefited from rushing in and getting things first. That’s sometimes the trade off, that not everything will work in your favor.

1 Like
4

Not yet but I will certainly do this… thank you for the reply and info.

5

While I understand your view, I would contend that if Soulswap is having these issues doesnt that point to a bigger problem with how the directions are spelled out? I heard of several other people who lost notable sums in the same process, to me that says perhaps the platform is also rushing things. I also find the claim that I was driven by “Greed” … to be inaccurate and derogatory, how can you say that? Ive been an ardent supporter of this platform since its inception, Im not some newbie here trying to milk the platform for gains. I am also offering to pay a substantial penalty and re stake the money to the platform for the greater good.

If you are saying that greed is the issue here and it is evident by rushing, then how do you explain the lack of an audit for this platform, does that not also say then that the bond system was rushed out? Especially in the era of rampant defi hacks, millions being lost across the space on the daily… How do you explain then the rushing of this platform putting everyones investment at risk? If not for the gains?

For me personally, like you, I am busy. I was at the airport when this event occurred, getting ready to board a flight. so this notion that I was rushing out of greed is an unfair assertion. Especially when you dont have all the information.

You of course have a choice to vote however you choose, but i personally having now gone through this experience would be sympathetic to anyone in my position. I also feel that the potential penalties are entirely too severe, especially when soulswap depends on the very investors its penalizing, to provide liquidity to operate. in doing so the platform has created “artificial risk” where a ton of risk already exists. Why do this? Who not make this a positive experience all around? One member told me it was done so people could “get out of their bond and take the losses in order to “APE” into other opportunities” is this not the definition of greed? There is no valid reason to install this auto-donate mechanism to the bonding process, other than greed. It is harmful, I feel it should be removed, and with it should go this damaging, artificial risk that is unnecessary and dangerous to investors.

thank you,

//DJS

1 Like
6

Can you tell me where I would provide the transaction info, would it go into the proposal itself? and in what form, the tx hash im presuming?

Thank you for your assistance. //DJS

7

Just reading the chat in questions on Discord. I’d refund your money. I think it needs to be much clearer that A. You don’t get your money back from the Bonding LP. (I already know that’s the case from prior chats that I’ve had personally with the devs but a new person would not clearly know where to find this.) and 2. That you can’t increase the LP size is a strange choice to me. I don’t quite see why you wouldn’t be able to do this, seems beneficial to the project - more money basically. I can see removing harvest is a one time thing, but I don’t see that adding should be.

It might be a contract thing because all additions to any pool in Soulswap auto harvest to your wallet. But other DeFi protocols don’t all have such contracts. So that might be why it happens - you try to add, it says that during that process you’re also harvesting, and bam, you lose your money.

If adding has to be or it’s decided that it should be or has to be like that then I think that should be made VERY clear on the page or have a warning come up as you’re doing it, something like: “are you sure you want to add liquidity to this pool, you will lose your existing LP tokens”

For these reasons and the fact it’s very early days, I think you should get your money back and safeguards should be put in place.

1 Like
8

Hi Buns, the snapshot proposal window is saying I need 100K soul to make a proposal, I do not have this in my wallet currently. would it be possible to get a waiver so I may post my snapshot vote to the DAO?

thank you.

//DJS

9

If anyone wants to share code for how to make such a pop-up, I would gladly do so and I would implement immediately, however I have done everything within my abilities to make it abundantly clear how the contract functions and insisted to not use the contract if you did not fully understand it. I even went so far as to insist asking us questions if you’re unsure about anything.

@SoulFan No one made you ignore every warning sign. Avoid interacting with that which you do not understand – categorically. Please heed this advise.

  1. The warnings are in the same place as the withdraw fee warnings on the farms once resided, so this makes it equivalent to the 14% withdraw fee, which was acceptable by last week’s standard.

  2. There is the bright banner at the top of the page informing you to read first and contains a link where you may ask questions and read our full disclaimer, and is typed in all caps in order to make it abundantly clear and to provide any rational person the opportunity to seek clarification prior to depositing into the contract.

  3. Interacting with a contract without even attempting to ask for further clarification is wreckless. Going so far as to undermine everything I have built off a mistake YOU made is disgraceful and speaks volumes about your character. It’s saddening you could so quickly flip the script on us because of what you recognize as an oversight you made – not us. We did our due diligence, but you failed to do the same on your end.

  4. I have tried to help, but you are continuing to degrade the protocol at every opportunity to make it somehow fall on our shoulders. You’re free to speak our mind, but just know that in doing so, you welcome me to use every bit of my voting power to shut down this proposal and lobby against it and previously I told myself to leave myself out of the vote and be the bigger person, but you are seriously leaving me with no other choice as you have utterly no regard for anyone but yourself and this post and your false attempt at solidarity via your profile you created today named “SoulFan” to rally users in your favor is almost insulting to the intelligence of this community. Those who are paying attention see this situation for what it is.

  5. There is absolutely zero need for you to go around slandering us with public statements on social media (namely Twitter) alleging we are “stealing” from anyone or even “penalizing” for that matter, when we are doing neither one of those things. Do you have any consideration for my personal safety? My mental well-being? My ability to focus on anything beyond the dozen or so tweets you’ve made today and are likely continuing to make?

There comes a point where your freedom of speech becomes harmful and degrading and this is just that – all in pursuit of likely less money than I have given out for free to our community for one reason or another because I am a giving and forgiving person, but you are really out for attention today, so this is what you are met with.

There comes a point where you have to learn to communicate in a manner that is conducive of the end result you are seeking. Demeaning me is the quickest way to lose my support. Why would you continue doing so? What ends are you willing to go to to avoid accepting blame? Why not take ownership for your errors and mention everything you’ve mentioned without also including such demeaning statements? Have you any consideration for how negatively this has effected me personally? Why do I need to be answerable to you when I am building a protocol that is much larger than both me and you?

Perhaps @e0rum is correct in their assertion that greed guides your decision-making and I do hope you come to your senses and realize - on the most fundamental level - your lack of discipline and composure is precisely what has led you to this investment decision and to your detachment from the realization that blasting harmful statement against a protocol works against getting said protocol to be on your side. This makes it that much more difficult for anyone to want to find a middle ground and work for you. It hurts me to see this. It has bothered me all day. I needed to let it out because otherwise I am doing a disservice to you and to myself because you need to hear from me what you’re doing right now is not how you get what you want. Not here, not anywhere.

2 Likes
10

I understand your frustration buns, so please let me take a moment to apologize for anything ive said that was found to be offensive. As a member of this DAO, and a long time investor and liquidity provider on Soulswap it is not my intention to degrade the platform. I would like to discuss this with the members in a constructive manner. In my defense, have found some of the responses to my pleas wholly unsympathetic, and that also hurts. If we are to work together as a team, repeatedly being told you dont have time for me, telling me im stupid, greedy, or refusing to even hear my pleas for help… that is also is hurtful. it ALSO erodes faith in the platform, so while this has been a difficult situation for me, I also feel that as a member of this group I have not been treated with the patience and respect that perhaps i have earned by being a long time investor.

So can we start again? and try to work together? I am here to try and find a solution here for all, that is a win win for both you, your team, and the DAO as a whole. I know you are busy, but i too have my hands full. So perhaps we can both work to have a little patience with each other and find a solution?

As Ive always expressed, I will show the same respect as I am given. So perhaps we can both work on trying to let kindness win the day? I promise to do so… this too is haunting me as well, this entire experience.

I also agree to accept the guidance and decision of the DAO as a whole, and i hope you and I can find a path to common ground through mutual respect. I will give my word as a member to come from a place of kindness at all times going forward.

thank you, //DJS

1 Like
11

Sure thing <3 Please share the transaction, so we can know what we are working with here. If you’re unsure, just share your address and I will see what I can find and you can confirm whether the transaction is correct.

12

Thank you… and hey, let me send you a sincere and heartful apology to you personally for any strife this has caused you. and i mean that… I know you are a very busy person, and you are doing your best to keep the wheels on this ever growing machine. I respect and honor you and your hard work, you have done amazing things with this platform. I have listened to you speak in the town halls, I have seen your dedication to this great cause. I am engaged even if my voice is not heard. I, like many here am watching closely. We see you Buns, and all you do. respect.

regarding the address, may i send you this in a DM? And let me add, I am committed to returning a portion of my lost funds, if any are returned, as a good faith donation to the DAO and the platform, for their effort and time invested in helping to find a solution here. A huge thank you to all, regardless of the outcome.

//DJS

1 Like
13

Buns heres my addy… 0x833ebd5452E847EB3451D4dc4A3916926DB85cba

thank you for taking a look. and if you need me to find the transactions, im not especially proficient at that, but ill do my best to try and help this take as a little time as possible. There are two FTM/BTC & FTM/BNB

1 Like
14

Yikes, this hurts to see. Looks like you pretty much immediately bonded after you deposited based off the few Soul rewards from your first mint: Fantom Transaction Hash (Txhash) Details | FTMScan

And you did it again here immediately afterwards: Fantom Transaction Hash (Txhash) Details | FTMScan

IMHO, it’s clearly an accident and if you’re trying this hard to get back your funds, then I don’t see why not.

@e0rum I get it’s a matter of principle and setting precedent, but since this decision is made by a body of people, I don’t think “setting precedent” plays that strong of a role as each voter is able to independently gauge the authenticity of a request and evaluate the situation in a larger context. In this context and in this instance, I personally don’t see why not beyond some unfounded fear of this methodology being abused.

What would be the benefit of sending over funds to then take a penalty upon withdrawal to recover and have to wait for governance to hopefully pass? Not much of a con, haha. I wouldn’t mind it, in fact, if each participant in said con tried this at the expense of a share of their accidental rewards, haha.

I will respect the decision the DAO makes and I don’t see why I wouldn’t vote affirmatively in this instance. I would like for you to clarify that you are willing to incur a penalty for the time and grievances involve.

What fee are you willing to pay for this endeavor? Please be realistic. I am simply trying to recall what you proposed originally. Also, I think we should remove anything that can’t be guaranteed on your behalf. We can make guarantees as the enactors of the proposal, but you cannot as we cannot hold you responsible after you receive the funds. So, that being said, it makes the most sense to only stick to what we can guarantee will occur in the event of a favorable outcome (affirmative vote). In this case, we can guarantee a reduction of a predetermined amount as a self-imposed fee.

15

Buns I so appreciate this post, and even with this, I understand this is a group decision, I will absolutely honor the word of the DAO as final, and I will do so without question.

I have not been able to upload the poll to vote on, but in short what i created was a vote with three choices… A. Return the funds with a 10% penalty b. Return the funds with a 25% penalty, or c. do not return the funds. Whatever is chosen I will honor it as final.

As of now I cannot upload due to the 100k soul wallet minimum for posting the proposal. If there is a way to work that out, I have no problem donating whatever funds are asked of me back to the dao as a donation and token to show my appreciation to all for their effort in helping me here.

I realize there’s no way to lock up the remaining funds in a bond of farm for a set duration, but I am willing to commit to providing the remaining liquidity back to soulswap as liquidity for up to 6 months in whatever farm, bond or stake the dao suggests. Also, If I am allowed to do this, I would enjoy the opportunity to prove that I am a team player, and I can be trusted to follow through on my commitment to the DAO; and to the entire soulswap community. So Im open to suggestions for how these returned funds might be best allocated to benefit all involved.

thankyou,
//DJS

1 Like
16

Everybody is right here, but the communication form is indeed not really helping…

First off, Soulfan did not do proper due diligence. Besides not knowing that adding to the position was not possible, the whole concept wasn’t understood. There is no penalization, let alone theft, here. Just sales of an lp token in exchange for indefinite variable yield.

I do however sympathize with the fact that the rules of the game were unfamiliar. I’ve come to understand that the reason it works like this is actually to keep your funds as safe as possible. Every significant smart contract change opens up potential new exploits, so it makes a lot of sense to do it like this (even though it’s not ideal from a user’s perspective). Buns has expressed on many occassions that this is a primary focus, and that she takes her responsibility on this to heart. That’s the complete opposite of the allegation that the process is set up to steal funds.

Nonetheless, I do think that the UI should have protected against this type of mistake. It might have been best effort, but it wasn’t enough imo. Particularly because there’s no room for error and the potential drawback is so large…

I would be in favor of some form of restoration, but think that this should be in a fixed/formalized format for everybody that is affected by the same mistake. I’ve seen other people on telegram, who had the same and just took it is as a loss for which they were responsible themselves. Therefore, it might be good to define a short cancellation/restoration period. At least until UI is improved on this aspect. Something along these lines:

Requirement: Loss (principal-reward) due to accidental mint is > 90% AND happened within 3 days after initial bond.

Restoration:

  • Return 90% of lp principal (10% penalty due to user mistake)
  • Harvest rewards are burned

Might be a nice first use case for the atomic swap functionality (wen atomic swap?).

1 Like
17

Buns… Good morning, and thank you for taking the time review the transactions, I realize without a doubt there are better more productive ways you would like to spend what little time you have. So I am grateful for your effort. I submitted some thoughts on penalties n what not, but it was hidden by akismet… not sure if youre able to se it, but basically it included a commitment to reinvest liquidity up to 6 months as a chance to demonstrate my commitment to the DAO, and these were the vote options I proposed.

A. Return funds with 10% penalty
B. Return of funds with a 25% penalty
C. no Return of funds

I also am prepared to fully accept the decision of the DAO as final, without question or critique.

It wont let me post the proposal due to the 100K Soul minimum wallet holding. but let me know what you think, does this sound fair n and workable?

thanks to all for their time n effort on this. //DJS

2 Likes
18

I have not yet minted the soul bonds hence I’ll ask this question for those who have.
If you click on mint soul, does the transaction immediately happen and mint whatever would present or does it have to be approved first through your wallet like meta mask?

If the former is true, then there’s issues that the UI doesn’t give participants chance to correct and 100% i’d be in favor of returning funds.

If you have to click another button on your wallet to authorize the mint transaction, then I’d blame it on the user not understanding the concept of bonding due diligence like @DefiDt suggested or not DYOR. On greed (which is not necessarily a bad thing), it can cause people to rush through things without thinking consequences. I’ve lost and paid because of this.

Personally I do love the idea of bonding and one can forever get rewards without minting, I don’t like the idea of being unable to add more LP’s but that the way the contract was written.

@SoulFan The direction Souldswap is taking is the long road so if in for the long haul down the road you’ll definitely benefit from your mistake.

3 Likes
19

You do have to confirm with your wallet before proceeding with the mint. It’s not like anyone can “accidentally” mint. It takes intentionality.

1 Like
20

Give it another try and please be sure to follow the following format:

Title: Refund Accidental Bond

In the details, please include this link: Request return of funds lost in bonding